Hi all,

Has anyone who has rolled out any virtualized applications to an enterprise gotten a statement from their anti virus vendor that says that they support this type of application?

We called our AV vendor Symantec, and the response was that they have never heard of application virtualization and that they do not support virtualized applications...

Specifically we are looking at Thinstall, however Altiris SVS and MS app virt product may be used in the furture...

Any thoughts or response would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Joe
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I had to laugh when I first read this post, because Symantec now owns Altiris SVS. http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,2142086,00.asp I'm just wondering if there was a communication gap with whoever you spoke with - I have a hard time believing that they would state don't support app virtualization.
Answered 02/05/2008 by: BadShadd
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Answered 02/05/2008 by: BadShadd
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Thanks for the links... I know it really ironic maybe even moronic for a Symantec tech to say that they don;t support virt apps...

Were a Symantc (AV) and a Altiris (management) shop and to hear Symantecs response to our query was stunning...

It wasn't that they just said that they didn't support it... their respones was "What's application virtualization?"

But I guess my original question still stands... Has anyone ever gotten buy off from their AV vendor that they would support your virtualized applications? I am dealing more with the politics of deploying a new technology within our enterprise...

I am hoping that some one else has all ready blazed this trail...

Thanks

Joe
Answered 02/05/2008 by: jfd3
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Answered 02/05/2008 by: AngelD
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Thanks AngelD...

This answers the question from a SVS technology.... I am glad to see that Scott Jones jumped in and answered personally....

Does anyone else have input from a Thinstall perspective?

Thanks

Joe
Answered 02/06/2008 by: jfd3
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I havent addressed that by a Thinstall perspective but I do have some info from the SoftGrid perspective. Antivirus will be able to shut down malicious processes but cannot remove infected files from the environment. To clean the environment you have to reset the cache on applications that have infections inside them. So your operating system is shielded but there is an added management layer.

Based on how I understand Thinstall architecture it would be the same scenario for their product as well but my word isn't official. [:D]
Answered 02/06/2008 by: kkaminsk
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Hi Joe,

I usually get some response from Scott (SVS Product Manager) when asked but I was also hoping for Symantec's AntiVirus Product Manager to jump in. But I guess Scott's answer will be enuf for your request right?
Answered 02/06/2008 by: AngelD
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Hi AngelD,

If we could also get a Symantec AV product manager to give his thoughts on not only SVS but Thinstall and Softgrid applications.. That would be GREAT!!!! [:D]

If you could work that, I would be one happy camper...

Thanks

Joe
Answered 02/06/2008 by: jfd3
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I'll see what I can do but will not promise anything.
Answered 02/06/2008 by: AngelD
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Howdy kkaminsk - glad to see you chime in.

Do you have any references/documentation for your SoftGrid security response? I've been asked this before and answered similar to what you stated, but I answered based on 'hearsay' & theory. I would really like to have something in 'Black & White'.

TIA...
Answered 02/07/2008 by: BadShadd
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Unfortunately the information I have was with a product manager over the phone. I don't think MS has anything in official literature on this.
Answered 02/07/2008 by: kkaminsk
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Hi Kkaminsk,

Can you ask for something... I am also trying to get our MS TAM invovled to get an official statement from the MS app virt team...

Additionally I am also working with VMware/Thinstall for the samething with Sytmantec...

In essence though, I just can not believe how behind the curve the AV vendors are regarding this technology... Its not like this technology just appeared last week... Makes you wonder where else are they a sleep at the wheel...

Joe
Answered 02/08/2008 by: jfd3
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Joe,

I've havn't heard from my Altiris (Now part of Symantec) contact yet but my guessing would be as long as the AV sees all the API calles made by the virtual process it shouldn't matter if it's virtualized or not.

/Kim
Answered 02/08/2008 by: AngelD
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Hello Everybody,

I have read this topic troughtly maybe some comon sence. Maybe is a antivirus product isnt a so good candidate for application virtualisation because it communicate deeply with the OS it installed on?
Just some thoughts

With best regards,

Cybermage
Answered 02/08/2008 by: Cybermage
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AV products shouldn't be virtualized - they should be installed on your host platform. The discussion (from my interpretation) was focusing on AV & how it works with / protects the host system from 'infected' virtual apps. The interest was primarily focused on how AV & VA vendors back their products.
Answered 02/08/2008 by: BadShadd
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BadShadd...

Yes exactly...

Joe
Answered 02/08/2008 by: jfd3
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As with any technology, security seems to be an afterthought. I think the issue with allowing AV programs to clean virtual environments is that a virus could leverage the same entry point into the virtual environments as well. I haven't seen a customer who is using app virtualization get cold feet because of this but I would be nice to see documented statements from vendors. Hopefully your TAM can beat that information out of the product team but in regards to the community there should be more disclosure on this.
Answered 02/08/2008 by: kkaminsk
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